One of my first posts for ChurchMag was a “gentle” complaint about how boring and bothersome church announcements can be. We’re still working on how to jazz up our in-service-announcements, but we have made some strides in the overall methods by which we communicate with our people.
A while back, we set up two flat-panel TV’s on our balcony that played a PowerPoint presentation fed from a PC in our sound booth. It was a nice addition, but the way our foyer was designed prevent most people from benefiting from these TV’s. That’s why, earlier this spring, we added two more near the ubiquitous coffee-and-donuts sitting area. This time, however, the signal is being provided by a pair of Apple TV’s.
What Can You Do With an Apple TV?
The answer to that question is “plenty.” Of course, I’m sure that there are other devices on the market—Hello, Chromecast!—that can do them as well. What we like about the Apple TV is that it’s so easy to use. Currently, we have one TV display a Flickr stream of images designed as announcement slides, each one being perfectly formatted for the Apple TV. The other displays an image stream of pictures from our summer events. Basically, from any seat in our cafe area you can see what events we did this summer and what events are on the horizon. It’s as simple as looking from your left to your right.
Now, this is what we have done so far. Our plans, however, are much bigger. I personally have toyed with the idea of using one in our youth room. We have an HD projector that currently runs off an old Mac. On Sunday’s, when I work with our middle school youth group, I’m often left without help in the sound booth. If we had an Apple TV as an option, I could switch the projector’s input and AirPlay my Keynote right from the stage. That leads right into setting up an HD media cart powered by an Apple TV and HD projector to be used for seminars, board meetings, and large-scale classes.
On the horizon, we’ve got another project in the works: a digital photo board for our members/attenders and for our missionaries. Currently, we have a huge bulletin board with our attendees pictures and names which was designed to help everyone get to know each other as we grew from a smaller to a medium-sized church. However, we soon reached a point where it was quite a bit of work to take the photos, crop, label, print, and post each one onto the board…only to have to remove some and reshuffle the rest as parishioners left/moved/died/etc. Thus, the idea of a digital “photo board” has been in the slower cooker for some time. We’re also likely to package this project with a similar one which will allow us to stream videos and photos from missionaries that we support across the world. Years ago, we used to have a wall of plaques, each one bearing the name and photo of the missionary along with the name of their field—if it was safe to mention. This was not a viable option for us in our current building, and I for one feel that our congregation could benefit from being better connected with these courageous servants of God.
What If…
Ok, after I’ve written all of this, it looks like this is basically a fancy way to share pictures and video. Isn’t there anything else that these devices can do? Maybe….Rumors abound about Apple trying to get into the video game console market. While I wouldn’t buy a Apple TV counting on these rumors being true, it is an application that I personally think will be coming at some point. Apple has created an incredible marketplace for games and apps, and I cannot see Apple keeping the Apple TV out of that marketplace much longer. When it does get into that market, the Apple TV will stop being a nice addition to your church tech inventory, but may very well become a necessity.
Does your church use Apple TV’s?
How so?
If not, do you see a way in which they could help you?
Josh Youngbar says
We use AppleTVs as well. We use it for “photos” slides of events and info people need to know. We also use an app called AirFoil to stream music that is in sync through out the common areas in the church. works great
Phil Schneider says
Dude, that’s awesome. Love the idea of using AirFoil to stream music. I definitely might have to “appropriate” that idea. Thanks!
Douglas Porter says
We use a Mac mini for that reason. The Apple TV is too limited. It would be good as a second display for a mac or air display for an iPad or iPhone. We buy Sony TVs because they have easy ways to plug in a jump drive and display a photo, video or photo slideshow with nice transitions and low loading times. We’ve found that a large flatscreen on wheels ends up being less cost than multiple large posters over time. Plus it can be used for more than just a mobile sign like gaming for youth, sports watching, movies for nursery, meetings, bible studies, etc.
Phil Schneider says
Apple TV’s are a bit limited, but that limitation of options does provide for increased simplicity. Plus, the $99 price tag makes it a lot easier for a church to pick up one or two ATV’s versus a Mac Mini.
And yet, I completely agree with you. I would LOVE to have Mac Mini’s for this very purpose, but we had to settle for the ATV because of the price tag.
Thanks for the comment, Douglas!
Matt says
We’re looking at doing something very similar in our church in rural Iowa. I have an Apple Tv in my own home, and I have loved how I can also use its “Screen Saver” function to display images from a shared photo stream. In my opinion, it may be easier to simply add a graphic of the right dimensions to this shared photo stream and have the Apple Tv scrolling these images in a screen saver.
Also, you may want to edit one sentence: “Years ago, we used to have a wall of plagues, each one bearing the name and photo of the missionary along with the name of their field—if it was safe to mention.”
A wall of plagues. hehe.
Eric Dye says
Matt,
As Editor, let me just say that I am very tempted to leave this typo in place, as it has to be the most EPIC ChurchMag typo to date. The idea of there being “a wall of plagues,” not only brings me to a brimming giggle, but a slight cringe of Old Testament fear.
Thank you for reading. 😉
Phil Schneider says
It might be easier to do that with the Screen Saver, but we had a reason for using Flickr….which I’m having trouble remembering right now.
I think it may have been because our pastor takes a lot of pictures with his fancy Cannon camera and then uploads them to Flickr as hi-res since Flickr offers far more storage. That way, the files can be displayed from there and essentially stored there until needed again.
If that’s not an issue for you, then I don’t see why using the iCloud stream should be a problem. Although, if you were planning on streaming from a computer’s shared iPhoto library, that may not be the best option since that computer would have to always be on and would probably experience some sluggishness since it would have the Apple TV pulling data constantly.
Even still, I’m not sure if we had a “better” reason. If I remember, I will definitely share.
Erik Scottberg says
Matt/Phil
(I should probably clarify that I’m Phil’s pastor).
We use Flickr to stream the pictures because of the way iTunes works with Slideshows from iPhoto. We also have an old “pro” account at Flickr. I use it as an offsite backup of all our photos because it preserves the full resolution and was an inexpensive option.
We have an iMac that is always on at the church and it’s the computer we were streaming our iPhoto Slideshows from initially. The problem with iTunes and iPhoto is that you have to close iTunes and reopen it for the AppleTV to “see” the new/updated slideshow. At the time, it was just easier for me to create a set on Flickr and tell the AppleTV to play a slideshow of that “Announcement Set” (the iMac was across the building and it was a pain to run over just to restart iTunes). Now I just upload new images to the Flickr set and delete old ones out.
Matt, if are you referring to the iCloud Photostream, that’s something I hadn’t considered (I’m not sure if that was an option at the time?). I’d need to think through how that would work. Is this something you do? I think my issue would come down to the fact that I have two Apple IDs (personal and church). I’d have to log in and out to access those files and change the photostream…. Hmmm…going to have to play around with this.
Thanks,
Erik (Phil’s pastor)
Erik Scottberg says
1) I have no idea why I mentioned that I’m Phil’s Pastor twice…. I think maybe that “wall of plagues” is hampering our ability to type.
2) I think the other issue I was having is that I was using remote access to get onto the church iMac. It was just a pain to have to log in, send pictures over, create a slideshow, close iTunes, open iTunes, etc. The workflow was a mess. With Flickr I uploaded it once and it was ready to go.
Phil Schneider says
Thanks for jumping in, Pastor Erik. I knew there was more reasoning that went into the decision to use Flickr.
matt says
A question that I have about either option–using flickr or photostream:: Does the AppleTV load the images into its own memory, or does it use the network to load each and every individual image every time?
Our church has limited bandwidth, and I’d like to also not worry if our internet goes down that we’d lose the images on the tv’s.
Phil Schneider says
Great question! My pastor is going to look into this tonight. (I don’t have a Flickr account, and I won’t be home till late tonight.)
Erik Scottberg says
Matt,
Sorry for the delay. I forgot to check on this. I’m not sure how long it will hold or if it holds all of the images, but it seems like it does load your slideshow into the memory.
I’m basing this off the fact that I started a slideshow on my AppleTV and then turned my router off. The slideshow continued to play after this. I only let it run 5-10 minutes, but it just kept looping.
I hope that helps.
Chris says
I have tried to use Apple TV teaching a class, using an iPad and a digital projector. But frankly I’ve found rhe setup to be a bit laggy. Especially if I wanted to play a YouTube clip, it actually became quite a distraction.
Phil Schneider says
I, too, have noticed that the YouTube app lags badly on the ATV. Have you tried downloading/embedding the clip in your Keynote?
Michael B says
Great Article. We only use the Apple TV when whoever’s speaking want to use an iPad, which we did a couple days ago. Our pastors aren’t as technical as some so we have to walk them through the connection/mirroring process every time.
Phil Schneider says
Thanks, Michael! I feel the same way! It’s pastor-proof.
David Strader says
I realize that I’m pretty late to the game on this post but we’re considering switching from our old PC to pure Apple TV for all our projection needs. Honestly, I’m hesitient so seeing this post and knowing that others use it, helps a ton.
A few questions, however:
1) We have 3 screens, one on each side of the church + 1 in the back. Is it best to have 3 Apple TV’s? Can they sync today? Or should we have ONE and run HDMI’s and split the connection?
2) I’ve always thought Apple TV required internet connection to function, is this still the case in 2015?
3) We’ll be using OnSong to project lyrics, do you guys use this? If not, what do you use to project lyrics?
4) With Chromecast and all the other casting technology nowadays, is there now a better option?
Thanks!
David Strader
Youth Pastor, TLC
Phil Schneider says
Hey, David. Let me reply to your questions one at a time.
1) If you’re trying to run three, identical, simultaneous displays then you’d need an HDMI spitter that splits the Apple TV’s output to three separate TVs. But that could possibly lead to some long HDMI cable runs, and that’s not cheap cabling. The benefit of the Apple TV is its wireless nature. Our Apple TVs are used primarily in classrooms where only one TV is needed, or in our foyer, where each TV is playing the same Flickr slideshow, though it’s being displayed indecently on each. If you’re going to go to all of the trouble to split and run cables from an Apple TV, then I would just get an HD output from your computer and run that directly to the TVs.
2) Apple TV’s do no require the Internet if you’re using AirPlay to stream wirelessly from an iOS device or Mac. However, they DO have to be connected to the same network as those devices, either by WiFi or by ethernet cable. Basically, you have to have an in-house network which all the devices share, so you might as well connect that network to the Internet. I know that this sounds convoluted, so let me give you an example. Two years ago, I had a DSL internet connection, which was terrible. I would often give up streaming Netflix over the Internet and switch to streaming a movie from my Mac using my WiFi as a shared local network.
3) We don’t use OnSong. We use ProPresenter, but let me make this clear—we don’t use Apple TVs to run our in-service video. We have an HD output from our computer in our soundbooth.
4) Great question about Chromecast. I don’t know much about it at all. I’m an iOS-only kind of guy. Also, it looks like OnSong isn’t ready to support Android yet, so that might be something to think about.
I hope that helps. Thanks for the questions.
David Strader says
Phil – thanks for the detailed responses, it really helps me confirm that Apple TV is NOT the best option for our main sanctuary needs.
I’ve come to the realization that we really do need ProPresenter – it allows for remote control via iOS devices which is really why we wanted to use OnSong in the first place plus offers a slew of other great features. We currently have an OLD version of Easy Worship now.
I think running the HDMI cables and connecting them to a Mac is the only option for us at this point. We need the flexibility + want to run multiple screens seamlessly.
We’re a small church (60-80) currently, so I’m just trying to find a way out of buying a $400 program such as ProPresenter which we really can’t afford at this time.
…my search continues but I seem to always come back to the same solution 🙂
Phil Schneider says
You might want to try to contact ProPresenter by phone. They *may* have discounts for small churches.
Hope you can find something that works without breaking your budget.
Ron Majiros says
Since 2005 we had used a Mac Mini as the media server and projections source in our church and it served us well at that time but since the mini could not manage multiple displays effectively we had to use a projector that provided a VGA through back to our sound room monitor and then use the video mute function on the remote to show and hide the Beamer while playing/queuing media. It worked well but required a skilled operator to keep it smooth and professional.
We are in the process of upgrading the mini to a newer model that has more display functionality and will also need to upgrade the projector to HD at this time. However, in the mean time we have already installed an Apple TV and HDMI to VGA converter on the projection system and were using it as the primary source for church media. The ATV is set up for AirPlay and we are sending the audio to our sound board via a late model AirPort Express, which is actually serving as the main router. There is the capability of sending audio not from the HDMI converter back to the sound board via wire but in testing the sound quality was not as good as AirPlay. Being an older projector with a full range of analog inputs, we also have our DVD player connected as a separate source that is easily switched by remote.
What we like about this setup is that we are able to AirPlay media from iOS devices (iPads mostly) or call up media on the Mini (serving as a media server) or even iCloud from the iOS Remote app (this requires setting up Home Sharing on the ATV and in iTunes on the media server, which requires a free iCloud account)
The limitation is mainly Audio playback as you will find it necessary to switch between the AirPlay destinations depending on the media format being sent. In our case, we select Beamer (with mirroring) to send video (with or without audio) to the projector and we have to select Sound Board to play audio only formats. You may also find it necessary to adjust the AirPlay audio output volume from the ATV to the other AirPlay source. This is not intuitive and is hidden functionality of ATV.
Overall, it works well for us as a small group but it’s probably not the best way to go for larger groups that need a more professional presentation. The good news is that this technology has come a long way very quickly and the future is bright.
Phil Schneider says
Ron, you have have clearly has some serious time to sort this out! 🙂
I totally agree about the audio issue, though. We were going to use an ATV in our auditorium for a class this past week when we remembered the audio situation.
Thanks for the comment.
Keisha says
I just want to say, I’m part of a new church plant in Brooklyn. I lead the Creative Arts/Media team and we just got into a new space– Praise God! This has been SO helpful even into 2016! God bless.
Phil Schneider says
Keisha, that’s awesome! I’m so glad this has been a help!
Sal says
I have a similar question. I am the non-tech tech guy in my small church of 150. We use 1 IMAC with Propresenter to show slides during our services on a screen from a hdmi projector. We use a second IMAC with Wirecast to livestream to YouTube. We have a TV in the lobby and a projector in another room that I would like to broadcast announcements from propresenter, and then switch to the livestream directly from the other IMAC. Not sure how to do this. I was thinking about getting appletv’s for the TV and the projector in the other room. I am not sure how to use them or use Airplay – but I can learn.
Phil Schneider says
I don’t think you want to use AirPlay for that. It’s not nearly seamless enough. If you’re just wanting to switch back and forth, why not get an HDMI switch? The switch serves as a hub, combining the signal from both iMacs so that you can switch between whichever you need.
That’s how we do it. Let me know if that helps.
Bedys says
Good afternoon, I am new to this site. I was searching on how to announce our events on a tv in our church. I am a bit confused thou. Can you please clarify as to what I need please. I understood that it would be easy of just getting the apple tv and using flickr? please let me know if I am wrong and any tips will do.
Thank You
Phil Schneider says
I’m not entirely sure what you’re asking, Bedys. We set up a TV in our foyer with an Apple TV hooked up. We upload announcements to a Flickr album and then play that album on the ATV using the Flickr app.
What part is confusing?
Mark Richardson says
Hi! We are a reasonably large church in the UK (about 200 or so congregation each Sunday). I am the Operations Manager.
We use a projector plus 2 LCD screens running off Planning Center’s Projector software on an iPad. Planning Center have just discontinued Projector so I am looking to switch to a Mac based solution as we also have a Mac Mini hooked up to the projector and screens.
I am looking at ProPresenter and MediaShout, either of which would work but I prefer ProPresenter.
During mid-week, we also have an LCD screen in the Welcome Area that we use for smaller worship events. Currently we use the iPad via an Apple TV to project onto the screen. I am wondering if we can somehow send the Mac Mini ProPresenter output to the Apple TV and use the iPad to control the output (as the Mac Mini is in the main church so not really very accessible when we are all in the Welcome Area).
Will that work, or is there an alternative way we could do this? I should point out that we only have an Apple TV 3 at the moment, we haven’t upgraded to the newer version of ATV.
Phil Schneider says
Mark! I’m so sorry I didn’t get back to you sooner. I have a newish baby at home and my inbox has been an out of control jungle, so I missed the notification about this comment.
So, in answer to your question, I don’t think so. We use ProPresenter, and I’m not aware of a way to send the output video signal via AirPlay, which is what is required to use an Apple TV. I don’t know about MediaShout. I did a little research and there is a ProPresenter app for the new Apple TV, but it’s only designed to receive the stage display. Also, I checked and couldn’t find anything about MediaShout and Airplay either.
I think you’re better off continuing as you are or looking at an equipment purchase, i.e. a laptop that can run the presentation software you choose, and then using a traditional HDMI set-up.
Sorry I couldn’t be of more help.
Mark says
Hi and thanks for your reply.
The delay in your reply gave me time to do some experimentation.
It seems that I can do what I want to do. I setup our Church Mac Mini to use the AppleTV as a 3rd monitor (the 1st monitor is the small one sitting on the PA Desk, the 2nd is the Projector within the church).
I could then output whatever I wanted from the Mac Mini to the AppleTV (and therefore the TV) in the Welcome Area.
So I then fired up ProPresenter and told it to output to the 3rd monitor (while using the 1st monitor as the control display) and it worked perfectly! I even managed to get the iPad app working so I could sit in the Welcome Area, away from the Mac and control the presentation.
In theory I guess MediaShout could work just as well but the more I use ProPresenter, the more I like it!
I have also discovered that the Single Use Licence for PP allows installation on more than 1 computer (although you can only use it on one computer at a time – which is fine for us). Which means that if AirPlay ever does mess up, I can simply hook up my Macbook to the TV and carry on “offline”.
This is a big plus for us as our Wifi network is not the most reliable.
Thanks for your help!
Phil Schneider says
Mark, I’m so glad you were able to figure this all out, and I really appreciate you sharing your solution here so that others can benefit! Let us know if we can help in the future, though it seems like you’re more than up to any tech task!
Doug says
We are using Apple TV to run slides. We have the televisions turned portrait and turn the slides so they are long and skinny. The problem I am having is one of the tv’s stops showing the slideshow and reverts to pictures in my memory section. The others do not How can I fix.
Phil Schneider says
Hey, Doug. Are you showing the photos through the Photos app or some other way?